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The story
Episode 33 of NHK’s taiga drama “Toyotomi Brothers!”, titled “Farewell at Kitanosho Castle,” aired on August 30, depicting the deaths of Lady Oichi (played by Miyazaki Aoi) and Shibata Katsuie (played by Yamaguchi Makiya). The scene of the two holding hands and leaping from the nine-story castle tower sparked a huge reaction online, spreading a wave of "Oichi & Katsuie withdrawal" among fans. Discussion on 5ch ranged widely — from claims that Oichi didn’t actually commit seppuku in real history, to gripes that the staging felt abrupt given the tower’s height, to jokes comparing the scene to Lamba Ral from the anime “Gundam,” to evaluations of the cast’s acting (including Nakano Taiga and Ikematsu Sosuke), and even debates over the limits of historical-accuracy consulting.
Sponichi
NHK’s taiga drama “Toyotomi Brothers!” (Sundays at 8:00 PM), starring actor Nakano Taiga (33), aired episode 33, “Farewell at Kitanosho Castle,” on the 30th, depicting the deaths of Oda Nobunaga’s sister Oichi and his senior retainer Shibata Katsuie — roles skillfully played by actress Miyazaki Aoi (40) and actor Yamaguchi Makiya (53). Online, a wave of "Oichi & Katsuie withdrawal" spread, sparking a huge response.
<※Spoilers follow below>
Source: sponichi.co.jp / Original article here
What people said
Even though the two of them actually committed seppuku
It's fine if it's not totally historically accurate, but come on, a high-rise-building-style castle tower? lol
Nah, Oichi didn't commit seppuku.
Seppuku is brutally painful and grueling.
It's something samurai did to demonstrate strength of will —
not something women of samurai households did, since they weren't samurai themselves.
Women of samurai families just took their own lives by ordinary means. Chacha was the same.
So is Oichi going to act as kaishakunin (the second who delivers the finishing blow in seppuku) again?
Neither can convey any of the gravitas of someone in a position of power — it's nothing but shallow, lightweight acting
Well, Nakano is 'Imai,' so that figures (a nod to another role of his)
Seriously, the Hideyoshi acting is way too awful
It's childish and conveys none of Hideyoshi's menace
Worst portrayal in the franchise's history, easily
It's either shouting or mumbling under his breath, nothing in between
I don't think Ikematsu is actually that bad an actor
so the direction must be the real problem
At nine floors, maybe there's a chance you could actually fly lol
Kubozuka survived a fall from the 9th floor! (referencing actor Yosuke Kubozuka's real-life fall)
There were quite a few of those comments in the BS broadcast's live chat
You're an old dude too, aren't you
I don't get it, dattebayo (Naruto's verbal tic, used here for comic effect)
Yeah, I'd love to ask the screenwriter about that one
Jumping to your death did exist as a method
But I'd guess the higher your status, the less likely you'd choose it,
given the Buddhist religious views of the time
Same goes for Christianity
Jumping off something would be a shameful way for a samurai to die
No famous person ever actually did that
and the reason's obvious — it would just spark a pointless scramble to claim the head [as a trophy]
Hidenaga dies in 1591, so that's 8 more years to cover
Battle of Komaki-Nagakute → Tenshō earthquake → conquest of Shikoku → conquest of Kyushu → siege of Odawara → pacification of Ōshū
Guess it'll wrap up around there?
Looks like it'll end at Odawara
I'd like at least one episode devoted to the Toyotomi clan after Hidenaga's death
The screenwriter apparently said Hideyoshi and Hidenaga are like Nobita and Doraemon,
so maybe we get a senile, cornered Hideyoshi — after the invasion of Korea fails and he's purged Hidetsugu too — wandering Osaka Castle at night calling out for 'Koichiro' [Hidenaga's childhood name]
It's fiction at the end of the day, so they'll probably just kill Hideyoshi off with a narration-only death (a common taiga-drama shortcut) and have Hidenaga effectively stand in for him
'This head will earn you honor, take it' → 'His face is starting to burn, hurry and finish him!' → Keiji beheads him → 'Know that killing, too, can be mercy'
If they're going to fabricate stuff anyway, they should've given him a cool death like that
No one complains when the embellishment makes things better
Honestly, isn't this the kind of scene that would make the historical consultant go
'I really don't want people thinking I signed off on this show' and just bail?
I hear lately screenwriters don't listen to the historical consultants at all, and the consultants have been grumbling about it at talk events
Actually, the missionary Luís Fróis left a detailed written record of Katsuie's final moments
Apparently Katsuie ordered a sharp-tongued old woman who'd stayed in the castle to escape and report everything she witnessed to Hideyoshi's side
Basically, historical consultants only respond when screenwriters actually ask them something, explaining what really happened according to the record
In other words, if the writers or production team just decide to disregard history entirely, there's nothing the consultant can say about it
Consultants can flag issues in the script, but if NHK says 'we can't do that,' there's nothing more they can do
At most, once the whole drama has finished airing, they'll grumble at a talk event that 'I actually objected to that scene'
At the end of the day they're just hired help lol. All they can do is say their piece. The writers and director will hear them out, sure, but it ends with 'the final call is ours.'
They have zero real power lol. It's a bit different if you're the original novelist, but since dealing with an author threatening to walk is a hassle, that's probably why more recent taiga dramas have shifted to original screenplays lol
there weren't any tall buildings
Probably not, since there'd be a risk of your head being taken as a trophy
Castles aren't sheer and vertical like modern buildings, so you'd land on a lower roof instead of falling all the way down
they'll likely portray it as the Hideyoshi brothers trying to save him but arriving too late, so he takes his own life
There's actually a theory that Hideyoshi meant to save Hidetsugu
Hidenaga dies while Chacha's first son is still alive
The Hidetsugu incident happens after that child dies and Hideyori is born
so it's several years after Hidenaga's death
Background and Key Points of the Discussion
The main tower of Kitanosho Castle, where Shibata Katsuie made his last stand, is said to have had nine stories — larger in scale than Azuchi Castle. Regarding the deaths of Katsuie and Oichi, the missionary Luís Fróis left a detailed account, including an anecdote that an old woman was allowed to escape in order to give eyewitness testimony. Meanwhile, the role of historical consultants on taiga dramas is limited to flagging inaccuracies in the script — the decision of whether to actually act on their input rests with NHK and the screenwriters — so it isn’t unusual for a consultant to later reveal at a talk event, after broadcast, that “I objected to that scene.” Opinions in the thread split between those who found the staging acceptable (“fine if the embellishment works in a good direction”) and those who found leaping from a nine-story tower unnatural, as well as over the cast’s acting. On the historical side, some pointed out that Oichi didn’t actually commit seppuku, explaining that seppuku was samurai etiquette and that women of samurai households customarily took their own lives by other means. Underlying it all is a debate common to taiga dramas in general: how far to separate dramatic embellishment from historical fact in order to enjoy the show.
*This article is compiled and summarized from the 5ch (Geinou/Sports News+) thread “‘Toyotomi Brothers’ Shocks the Internet with an Unexpected ‘Nine-Story Tower Dive’ — ‘Lamba Ral?’ ‘Eternal Honorary Katsuie’ — Oichi & Katsuie Double Withdrawal Spreads.”
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