A post on 5ch’s hardware/industry board (“Geha”) claiming that Japan’s console game development power has fallen behind the West, China, and Korea to “4th place” sparked heated debate.
The thread saw opinions split over whether multiplatform Western developers or Nintendo hold the real technical edge, how Chinese games’ character designs stack up, and counterarguments citing Japan’s track record of GOTY (Game of the Year) wins.
With China and Korea's remarkable growth, Japan has slipped to 4th place in console games too
Maybe it's because Japan kept churning out nothing but kiddie JRPGs?
Maybe it's because Japan kept churning out nothing but kiddie JRPGs?
It's probably because of that garbage, low-spec hardware known as the Switch that domestic third-party devs' skills have declined.
Well, they've been making games on low-spec hardware ever since the DS, 20 years now…
The lost 20 years.
The lost 20 years.
No idea about PC, but on consoles Nintendo's still at the top, right?
It stagnated from kowtowing to Sony (mockingly called "Chony" here) and died out along with the "Trashstation" (a derisive nickname for PlayStation) pulling out.
Nintendo only has to worry about its own hardware, so it's not really "the top."
At the end of the day, studios doing multiplatform releases and optimizing for each platform individually are the ones actually ahead.
At the end of the day, studios doing multiplatform releases and optimizing for each platform individually are the ones actually ahead.
Re: #6
No matter how good your multiplatform optimization is, it's meaningless if the game itself isn't fun.
"Development power" isn't just raw technical skill.
No matter how good your multiplatform optimization is, it's meaningless if the game itself isn't fun.
"Development power" isn't just raw technical skill.
Re: #6
Isn't Nintendo actually ahead precisely because it doesn't have to bother with multiplatform releases?
Isn't Nintendo actually ahead precisely because it doesn't have to bother with multiplatform releases?
Japan's the only country that's been on some kind of punishment run for the past decade.
Overseas, the character designs in FE: Bansen Senkō ("Myriad Colors") are so godly that HoYoverse is getting mocked by comparison.
Re: #14
No idea about HoYoverse, but that FE claim has to be a lie.
It's crap.
No idea about HoYoverse, but that FE claim has to be a lie.
It's crap.
Re: #20
Well sure, if you're a creep whose brain's been polluted by panty-shot otaku bait characters from China, of course you'd think that.
Well sure, if you're a creep whose brain's been polluted by panty-shot otaku bait characters from China, of course you'd think that.
Re: #21
That's not the point.
That's not the point.
Re: #23
Isn't it simply that they made cool, cute characters with a Black-inspired motif — and this is a jab at political correctness?
Isn't it simply that they made cool, cute characters with a Black-inspired motif — and this is a jab at political correctness?
Re: #28
>cool, cute characters
Forget political correctness, the problem is that's just not true.
>cool, cute characters
Forget political correctness, the problem is that's just not true.
Honestly the West sounds like it's in the worst shape.
EA posted huge losses and got bought out, and Ubisoft's on the verge of bankruptcy.
Soaring semiconductor prices are stalling hardware specs, so spec-dependent games are going to have a rough time going forward too.
GTA might end up being the last big fireworks show.
EA posted huge losses and got bought out, and Ubisoft's on the verge of bankruptcy.
Soaring semiconductor prices are stalling hardware specs, so spec-dependent games are going to have a rough time going forward too.
GTA might end up being the last big fireworks show.
Re: #27
Well, honestly China and Korea are basically under the Microsoft empire's umbrella anyway.
As long as you control the PC OS and platform, you can make anything work.
Even Tencent is half like a global (European) company at this point, and the money behind that kind of investment ultimately traces back to the West anyway.
If they ever started rolling out their own independent OS, that'd be a real turning point.
But that edges into military-industrial territory, and mess with that and you're basically talking about war lol
Well, honestly China and Korea are basically under the Microsoft empire's umbrella anyway.
As long as you control the PC OS and platform, you can make anything work.
Even Tencent is half like a global (European) company at this point, and the money behind that kind of investment ultimately traces back to the West anyway.
If they ever started rolling out their own independent OS, that'd be a real turning point.
But that edges into military-industrial territory, and mess with that and you're basically talking about war lol
These days Japan's even losing to indie games.
Re: #32
Looking down on indies like that is the wrong mindset to begin with.
Out of countless creators out there, the ones with real talent don't necessarily come from the big publishers.
Of course the cream of the indie crop is more fun than a mediocre AAA game.
Looking down on indies like that is the wrong mindset to begin with.
Out of countless creators out there, the ones with real talent don't necessarily come from the big publishers.
Of course the cream of the indie crop is more fun than a mediocre AAA game.
Well, as long as people keep saying "China and Korea just copy everything," nothing's going to improve.
Japan's the one that's been coasting on assuming it was better than everyone else and doing nothing about it.
Japan's the one that's been coasting on assuming it was better than everyone else and doing nothing about it.
Re: #49
This is genuinely something to worry about.
Even at that robot sports day sprint race, the Chinese-made robot blasted through the finish line faster than Usain Bolt, while the Japanese one waddled along at a crawl lol
Though the Chinese one did come with the punchline of not being able to stop and slamming into the wall (cushion), exploding into flames lol
This is genuinely something to worry about.
Even at that robot sports day sprint race, the Chinese-made robot blasted through the finish line faster than Usain Bolt, while the Japanese one waddled along at a crawl lol
Though the Chinese one did come with the punchline of not being able to stop and slamming into the wall (cushion), exploding into flames lol
Re: #53
Japan can't even make a decent action game these days.
Japan can't even make a decent action game these days.
Re: #57
Oh yeah? Then name me an action game on the level of Sekiro.
Oh yeah? Then name me an action game on the level of Sekiro.
Go look at Reddit.
Stellar Blade and the new HoYoverse title get tons of comments.
Japanese games barely get any.
That's the reality of the world stage.
Stellar Blade and the new HoYoverse title get tons of comments.
Japanese games barely get any.
That's the reality of the world stage.
Re: #61
The new Mega Man is dominating there, actually.
Stellar Blade isn't even news anymore so it barely gets comments, and the new HoYoverse game barely even comes up as a topic, you idiot.
This time around there just wasn't much of anything generating buzz overall.
At most the trailers are only pulling 100k views.
Last time stuff like Resident Evil blew past a million views instantly.
The new Mega Man is dominating there, actually.
Stellar Blade isn't even news anymore so it barely gets comments, and the new HoYoverse game barely even comes up as a topic, you idiot.
This time around there just wasn't much of anything generating buzz overall.
At most the trailers are only pulling 100k views.
Last time stuff like Resident Evil blew past a million views instantly.
Every field Japan nurtured and made successful just gets copied and snatched away by China and Korea.
This can't go on! There's no time for Sony and Nintendo to be fighting each other.
This can't go on! There's no time for Sony and Nintendo to be fighting each other.
Re: #62
Like I care about some half-dead Western-game wannabe that Japanese developers fled from.
Like I care about some half-dead Western-game wannabe that Japanese developers fled from.
Re: #62
Though it's Sony that keeps courting and funding more and more Chinese free-to-play games…
Though it's Sony that keeps courting and funding more and more Chinese free-to-play games…
This year's TGA looks like it's going to be packed with Japanese games (since GTA seems to be eligible next year instead).
For the West, China, and Korea, I can't think of anything likely to get nominated.
Crimson Desert flopped too.
Action: Resident Evil Requiem
Adventure: Ocarina of Time Remake
Family: Pokémon
Racing: Forza Horizon 6
Simulation: FE: Bansen Senkō
Multiplayer: Gears of War: E-Day
For the West, China, and Korea, I can't think of anything likely to get nominated.
Crimson Desert flopped too.
Action: Resident Evil Requiem
Adventure: Ocarina of Time Remake
Family: Pokémon
Racing: Forza Horizon 6
Simulation: FE: Bansen Senkō
Multiplayer: Gears of War: E-Day
Re: #69
Well, China isn't exhibiting any games this year anyway.
Well, China isn't exhibiting any games this year anyway.
It's true that outside of FromSoftware and Capcom, Japan's basically wiped out.
Nintendo fanboys ("butas") like to downplay GOTY, but it's an award that makes creators worldwide go "damn, I wish I'd made that game," so it's extremely important.
Nintendo fanboys ("butas") like to downplay GOTY, but it's an award that makes creators worldwide go "damn, I wish I'd made that game," so it's extremely important.
Re: #96
If you're going to argue GOTY matters, then the country with the most wins is Japan — so what about China and Korea, who've never won it once?
Even Black Myth: Wukong, released in a weak year, couldn't take home GOTY, which flatly contradicts this thread's whole premise of hyping up Chinese and Korean games as amazing.
If you're going to argue GOTY matters, then the country with the most wins is Japan — so what about China and Korea, who've never won it once?
Even Black Myth: Wukong, released in a weak year, couldn't take home GOTY, which flatly contradicts this thread's whole premise of hyping up Chinese and Korean games as amazing.
Are Bansen Senkō's character designs really that brilliant?
Isn't it just a watered-down knockoff of Metaphor: ReFantazio?
Though I do have to admire the nerve, considering how hard they trashed Palworld over its design direction alone.
Isn't it just a watered-down knockoff of Metaphor: ReFantazio?
Though I do have to admire the nerve, considering how hard they trashed Palworld over its design direction alone.
Re: #102
What exactly does it have in common with Metaphor, specifically?
What exactly does it have in common with Metaphor, specifically?
Re: #103
The balance and direction of putting out good-looking characters while still dodging political-correctness backlash.
The balance and direction of putting out good-looking characters while still dodging political-correctness backlash.
Re: #107
That's it?
If that's the best you could come up with after really racking your brain, this isn't even worth discussing.
That's it?
If that's the best you could come up with after really racking your brain, this isn't even worth discussing.
*This article is excerpted and summarized from the 5ch (Hardware/Industry, “Geha”) thread “[Console Game Development Power] Japan Has Somehow Fallen to 4th Place, Behind the West, China, and Korea.”
