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The story
A thread titled “Capitalism—when you really think about it, something’s off” appeared on 5ch’s “Whatever Live” board (なんでも実況G), sparking a debate that began with frustration over how the rich monopolize wealth.
The discussion wound through the historical background of neoliberalism and totalitarianism before eventually landing on the question of whether effort or luck determines success — with one counterargument citing Shohei Ohtani as an example.
What people said
It's basically a lawless zone, isn't it
It's messed up that rich people can just hoard all the money.
If this were a video game, it'd be a certified trash game.
If this were a video game, it'd be a certified trash game.
Re: #4
Can't be helped — humanity hasn't found a better system than capitalism yet.
Can't be helped — humanity hasn't found a better system than capitalism yet.
I think compensation should fundamentally be a reward for labor.
A system where you can rake in insane amounts of money just from investing is broken.
A system where you can rake in insane amounts of money just from investing is broken.
Re: #8
If that were the case, no capitalists would bother creating jobs for people to work in. And if the government did that instead, that's just a planned economy.
If that were the case, no capitalists would bother creating jobs for people to work in. And if the government did that instead, that's just a planned economy.
What you guys actually want isn't capitalism or communism — it's just egoism where only you benefit.
Re: #16
Exactly that, basically.
Exactly that, basically.
Neoliberalism is the one thing Japan should never have let in.
Re: #22
Japan's already been neoliberal for quite a while now.
Japan's already been neoliberal for quite a while now.
Wait, who even came up with totalitarianism in the first place?
This is basically an ideology for manufacturing armies.
This is basically an ideology for manufacturing armies.
Re: #24
Fascism, a totalitarian ideology, was actually devised by an Italian communist.
Fascism, a totalitarian ideology, was actually devised by an Italian communist.
So totalitarianism was an extension of communism after all.
Thanks (Kansai slang for "cheers").
Thanks (Kansai slang for "cheers").
Re: #27 Re: #28
Nazism is what you get when you add nationalism and xenophobia into the mix to tighten control — but the two get mixed up pretty easily.
Nazism is what you get when you add nationalism and xenophobia into the mix to tighten control — but the two get mixed up pretty easily.
On the flip side, if everyone's equal like in socialism, the economy doesn't really develop.
Re: #32
As long as you've got the basics — food, clothing, shelter — plus some free time, who cares about the economy?
As long as you've got the basics — food, clothing, shelter — plus some free time, who cares about the economy?
Re: #32
By that logic, 98% of people under capitalism only contribute to 2% of its growth, so it'd be "correct" for that 2% to monopolize the wealth.
By that logic, 98% of people under capitalism only contribute to 2% of its growth, so it'd be "correct" for that 2% to monopolize the wealth.
Why don't you guys just become capitalists yourselves?
Re: #42
The risk is way too big, so most people never even consider it.
Also, just having this space where I can post with everyone here is enough for me.
The risk is way too big, so most people never even consider it.
Also, just having this space where I can post with everyone here is enough for me.
A lot of the people denying capitalism probably think if the world or the system changed, they'd suddenly rise to the top — total "isekai protagonist" delusion (a jab referencing wish-fulfillment web-novel tropes).
It's because you're not doing well yourself.
There's no system out there where you'd succeed.
There's no system out there where you'd succeed.
Re: #45
You're basically talking to a mirror there lol
No need to spell it out in a reply lmao
You're basically talking to a mirror there lol
No need to spell it out in a reply lmao
Looked up "loser cow" and the closest thing seems to be Chinese internet slang "niúmǎ" (牛马, "ox-horse").
It's a self-deprecating term used by workers exploited under harsh capitalist working conditions.
It's a self-deprecating term used by workers exploited under harsh capitalist working conditions.
The fact that it can't stop itself even when there's a cliff right in front of it is a real design flaw.
And the fact there's no decent alternative to it either — it's just garbage.
And the fact there's no decent alternative to it either — it's just garbage.
Re: #57
Is it really that much of a cliff, though?
I don't have any complaints.
Is it really that much of a cliff, though?
I don't have any complaints.
Re: #53
Huh? Wasn't that comment directed at me?
Guess I misread it then.
My bad.
Huh? Wasn't that comment directed at me?
Guess I misread it then.
My bad.
Re: #58
Just look at who I replied to…
Just look at who I replied to…
Re: #80
Without investment, corporations wouldn't even exist in the first place.
Then workers wouldn't have companies to work for, right?
Without investment, corporations wouldn't even exist in the first place.
Then workers wouldn't have companies to work for, right?
Re: #82
I don't think that proves investing counts as labor, though.
I don't think that proves investing counts as labor, though.
Re: #82
What you're saying is an extreme take.
I'm not denying that corporations should exist at all.
What you're saying is an extreme take.
I'm not denying that corporations should exist at all.
Re: #85
You're using your brain to pick where to invest, taking on risk, and putting your assets on the line — that's basically labor already.
You're using your brain to pick where to invest, taking on risk, and putting your assets on the line — that's basically labor already.
Re: #88
Then what exactly is "unearned income" supposed to mean?
Then what exactly is "unearned income" supposed to mean?
Re: #88
But you don't always get compensated for it, do you? Regular labor means getting paid for the time you put in and the work you do — and since investing doesn't guarantee that in the same way, investing isn't labor.
But you don't always get compensated for it, do you? Regular labor means getting paid for the time you put in and the work you do — and since investing doesn't guarantee that in the same way, investing isn't labor.
Isn't it fine if there's inequality?
I don't get why everyone gets so bothered by things not being equal.
Being born into a rich family is just lucky.
What's wrong with that?
I don't get why everyone gets so bothered by things not being equal.
Being born into a rich family is just lucky.
What's wrong with that?
Re: #107
Of course people build up resentment when they lose out due to luck that no amount of skill could overcome.
Of course people build up resentment when they lose out due to luck that no amount of skill could overcome.
Re: #114
That's what I don't get.
A huge part of Ohtani's success comes from being born with that physique — so does that mean you think Ohtani is "cheating" and it's unfair?
That's what I don't get.
A huge part of Ohtani's success comes from being born with that physique — so does that mean you think Ohtani is "cheating" and it's unfair?
Re: #119
He's not cheating, but he did get lucky.
He's not cheating, but he did get lucky.
Re: #119
Sure, Ohtani got lucky with his physique, but nobody complains because he put in the effort to make the most of it.
Being born rich, though, means starting on easy mode with an advantage and zero effort involved.
Lumping those two together doesn't make sense.
Sure, Ohtani got lucky with his physique, but nobody complains because he put in the effort to make the most of it.
Being born rich, though, means starting on easy mode with an advantage and zero effort involved.
Lumping those two together doesn't make sense.
It's fine for people who put in effort to earn more.
The problem is that, as things stand, plenty of benefits also flow to people regardless of whether they actually worked for them.
There's a gap between someone who happened to be born in a rich country and someone born in a poor one.
There's also a gap between someone who job-hunted during a boom and someone who did it during a recession.
And a parent's financial power has a huge influence on their child too.
The problem is that, as things stand, plenty of benefits also flow to people regardless of whether they actually worked for them.
There's a gap between someone who happened to be born in a rich country and someone born in a poor one.
There's also a gap between someone who job-hunted during a boom and someone who did it during a recession.
And a parent's financial power has a huge influence on their child too.
Re: #110
So what exactly is wrong with that?
"Equality is the ideal" is just a nice-sounding platitude — what are you, in elementary school?
So what exactly is wrong with that?
"Equality is the ideal" is just a nice-sounding platitude — what are you, in elementary school?
Re: #110
That's exactly why Gandhi affirmed the caste system.
Society, in whatever form it takes, is fundamentally a mass of unfairness and inequality.
Saying "it's a status given by God" is the simplest explanation — after all, being God, it's beyond human comprehension.
That's exactly why Gandhi affirmed the caste system.
Society, in whatever form it takes, is fundamentally a mass of unfairness and inequality.
Saying "it's a status given by God" is the simplest explanation — after all, being God, it's beyond human comprehension.
*This article is excerpted and summarized from the 5ch (Whatever Live) thread “Capitalism—when you really think about it, something’s off.”
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