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The story
Even when a high school player hoping to go pro says “I want to join the Giants,” NPB’s rookie draft meeting decides which team he actually lands on by lottery — his personal wish doesn’t factor in at all. A thread on 5channel’s “Live Breaking News G” board spiraled from questions about whether this system might run afoul of the law into talk of disparities in team strength and salaries, and even the history of the old “self-nomination” system that was scrapped after a slush-fund scandal. Opinions are split on how to balance the gap between players who land their preferred team with a first-round pick and those who miss out and get scooped up lower in the order.
What people said
High school player: "I've been a Giants fan since I was a kid — joining the Giants was my dream."
NPB: "Nope."
High school player: "…Huh?"
NPB: "Nope."
High school player: "…Huh?"
The Giants are one thing, but being forced onto a team like Rakuten or Lotte sounds rough.
Re: #3
Tanaka "Ma-kun" and Roki (Sasaki — the nickname "労基" is 5ch shorthand for Roki Sasaki) really had it rough.
Roki aside, Tanaka did great with a team like that — yet some flimsy, speculative tabloid story trashed his image and basically got him run out of the club. Pretty miserable.
Tanaka "Ma-kun" and Roki (Sasaki — the nickname "労基" is 5ch shorthand for Roki Sasaki) really had it rough.
Roki aside, Tanaka did great with a team like that — yet some flimsy, speculative tabloid story trashed his image and basically got him run out of the club. Pretty miserable.
Re: #3
Then again, it's a bit like Ohtani joining the Angels — sometimes it's precisely *because* it's a weak team that they'll actually use you and let you get away with crazy stuff.
If he'd gone straight from high school to the Dodgers, I bet they'd have stripped him of the two-way thing entirely.
Then again, it's a bit like Ohtani joining the Angels — sometimes it's precisely *because* it's a weak team that they'll actually use you and let you get away with crazy stuff.
If he'd gone straight from high school to the Dodgers, I bet they'd have stripped him of the two-way thing entirely.
Even some legal experts say "isn't this kind of messed up?" so OP's point isn't wrong.
But if you let players pick freely, the rich teams hoarding all the talent gets way worse.
But if you let players pick freely, the rich teams hoarding all the talent gets way worse.
Re: #5
Sure, you could do that, but then deregulating the foreign-player roster limit would have to come as part of the package too.
Sure, you could do that, but then deregulating the foreign-player roster limit would have to come as part of the package too.
In reality, no matter what you do with the draft, it always ends with SoftBank just poaching already-finished players and staying dominant.
"I want to go to the majors eventually, so any team's fine" — that's basically all you hear now.
Komada was the same.
Komada was the same.
Re: #8
Wouldn't a player like that just pick a team that promises to approve a posting at 25? Specifically, teams like the Fighters, the Buffaloes, or the Swallows.
Wouldn't a player like that just pick a team that promises to approve a posting at 25? Specifically, teams like the Fighters, the Buffaloes, or the Swallows.
Re: #8
Then I'm throwing you into a horde of zombies.
Then I'm throwing you into a horde of zombies.
Shouldn't first-round-caliber guys at least get to choose freely? If your lifetime earnings swing that much depending on which team you land on, I couldn't stand it if I were in that position.
Re: #19
Hell for whoever's picked 11th or 12th in the first round — the gap versus someone who gets his favorite team at the top of round two ends up way too big.
Hell for whoever's picked 11th or 12th in the first round — the gap versus someone who gets his favorite team at the top of round two ends up way too big.
Even America, the land of the free, has a draft…
Re: #26
They draft a huge number of players, and teams can trade draft picks with each other — totally different environment from Japan, where there are only a handful of genuinely promising prospects at draft time.
They draft a huge number of players, and teams can trade draft picks with each other — totally different environment from Japan, where there are only a handful of genuinely promising prospects at draft time.
Re: #30
Lol, that's not even a reason.
Lol, that's not even a reason.
Re: #30
MLB rookie: "I want to go to the Rays, Dodgers, or Yankees."
Angels: "Nope, we drafted you, so too bad~ 🤪"
That's exactly how it'd play out.
MLB rookie: "I want to go to the Rays, Dodgers, or Yankees."
Angels: "Nope, we drafted you, so too bad~ 🤪"
That's exactly how it'd play out.
Idiots keep defending the draft, but legal scholars generally lean toward "this is a problem."
Re: #28
Opinions are split, so you can't just say it leans toward being a problem. We won't actually know until someone sues.
Opinions are split, so you can't just say it leans toward being a problem. We won't actually know until someone sues.
I've seen the "teams are basically just departments [of one big NPB enterprise]" theory more times than my own parents' faces — but if that's the logic, at least standardize the pay/evaluation criteria across every team. Right now it's just dumping the burden on players while calling it "balance."
Re: #33
2017 Seiya Suzuki:
.300, 25 HR, .936 OPS, Best Nine, Gold Glove
¥60M → ¥90M
Doesn't even crack ¥100M. Cracks me up every time I see this.
2017 Seiya Suzuki:
.300, 25 HR, .936 OPS, Best Nine, Gold Glove
¥60M → ¥90M
Doesn't even crack ¥100M. Cracks me up every time I see this.
Re: #41
What really stands out is how, during that golden stretch when the team's core players all happened to peak at once while the rest of the Central League simultaneously got weaker, the club got cocky, neglected to make itself more attractive, lowballed Maru's evaluation, and just let him walk.
The sneaky part about Hiroshima is they deliberately kept the first-year base salary low, so even with comparable performance, hitting ¥100M would always come later than it should.
What really stands out is how, during that golden stretch when the team's core players all happened to peak at once while the rest of the Central League simultaneously got weaker, the club got cocky, neglected to make itself more attractive, lowballed Maru's evaluation, and just let him walk.
The sneaky part about Hiroshima is they deliberately kept the first-year base salary low, so even with comparable performance, hitting ¥100M would always come later than it should.
Re: #41
Normally that kind of performance gets you ¥200M.
Normally that kind of performance gets you ¥200M.
Are there really so few motivated high schoolers who'd say "I'll go pro with any team"?
Re: #37
It's less about motivation and more that these are players whose dream stops at just "becoming a pro baseball player," full stop.
It's less about motivation and more that these are players whose dream stops at just "becoming a pro baseball player," full stop.
Re: #37
These days the gap between teams isn't as brutal as it used to be, so more players are fine going anywhere.
That said, there's always talk that plenty of quiet "no thanks" happen behind the scenes.
These days the gap between teams isn't as brutal as it used to be, so more players are fine going anywhere.
That said, there's always talk that plenty of quiet "no thanks" happen behind the scenes.
A player who'd be a lock first-round pick anywhere else can end up rotting in a rich team's farm system, or just fizzle out as a nobody.
Take Osada (Giants → Orix), Nishioka's draft classmate — he declared he'd go nowhere but the Giants and got in with a 4th-round pick, even though he was rated higher than Nishioka back in high school.
Well, if the player himself ends up happier than he would've been as a starter on some poor team — even living off just the "incidental expenses" stipend — maybe it's fine for him personally, but it's a loss for the sport as a whole.
Take Osada (Giants → Orix), Nishioka's draft classmate — he declared he'd go nowhere but the Giants and got in with a 4th-round pick, even though he was rated higher than Nishioka back in high school.
Well, if the player himself ends up happier than he would've been as a starter on some poor team — even living off just the "incidental expenses" stipend — maybe it's fine for him personally, but it's a loss for the sport as a whole.
Re: #43
That said, while rotting on a rich team's bench draws easy criticism, it's not like playing time on a weak team automatically means happiness either.
With a weak team, goals are hard to set so motivation doesn't rise, the roster's too thin so opposing defenses key in on you and it's hard to shine, you get overworked, and you're more exposed to heckling from the stands.
And if you rack up playing time at a weak club and then leave via free agency, you risk getting blasted for "leaving the moment you grew up."
That said, while rotting on a rich team's bench draws easy criticism, it's not like playing time on a weak team automatically means happiness either.
With a weak team, goals are hard to set so motivation doesn't rise, the roster's too thin so opposing defenses key in on you and it's hard to shine, you get overworked, and you're more exposed to heckling from the stands.
And if you rack up playing time at a weak club and then leave via free agency, you risk getting blasted for "leaving the moment you grew up."
That's exactly why they turned it into the de facto self-nomination/free-agent-slot system to create open competition — but market forces kicked in, and slush money shot up even for mediocre 2nd-3rd-round-caliber players, while yakuza and semi-gangster types swarmed the star prospects. After the Ichiba scandal (a 2006 bribery case involving a draft pick), even the Giants — the team that had pushed for the system in the first place — finally couldn't take it anymore and brought back the lottery.
Re: #55
The self-nomination/free-slot system's place in history is complicated.
On the surface it looks like it wrecked the old draft's balance and became a hotbed of slush money and talent-hoarding — but actually, the era *before* self-nomination was introduced was the worst period for rampant slush money and hoarding.
Things like "undrafted" signings, "trainee" contracts, hiring guys as team employees, or getting players to publicly announce they were going to college or taking a job and then blindsiding them with a surprise pick — that's the famous playbook. The Seibu Lions built their golden era on exactly that.
Self-nomination, despite looking like a reckless, destructive system at first glance, actually curbed the hoarding somewhat.
But everyone just burned out from the slush-money arms race and mutually agreed to scrap it in the end — that's basically what happened.
The self-nomination/free-slot system's place in history is complicated.
On the surface it looks like it wrecked the old draft's balance and became a hotbed of slush money and talent-hoarding — but actually, the era *before* self-nomination was introduced was the worst period for rampant slush money and hoarding.
Things like "undrafted" signings, "trainee" contracts, hiring guys as team employees, or getting players to publicly announce they were going to college or taking a job and then blindsiding them with a surprise pick — that's the famous playbook. The Seibu Lions built their golden era on exactly that.
Self-nomination, despite looking like a reckless, destructive system at first glance, actually curbed the hoarding somewhat.
But everyone just burned out from the slush-money arms race and mutually agreed to scrap it in the end — that's basically what happened.
If players could go wherever they wanted, you'd get a flood of kids rushing to join the wildly popular Chunichi Dragons, and that'd be a whole mess.
Re: #57
Yeah — it's the kind of popular team that a superstar like Fukudome, who had zero ties to Aichi and was fought over by seven clubs, refused to sign anywhere else and used the self-nomination system just to join.
Yeah — it's the kind of popular team that a superstar like Fukudome, who had zero ties to Aichi and was fought over by seven clubs, refused to sign anywhere else and used the self-nomination system just to join.
Getting stuck with the Chunichi Dragons ("Chuni-Dora") basically means your life goes dark.
Re: #65
Yeah, especially seeing Kanemaru get flak for "bad tempo" and whatever else, when he's only losing because the team around him is garbage.
Yeah, especially seeing Kanemaru get flak for "bad tempo" and whatever else, when he's only losing because the team around him is garbage.
Re: #65
Even a third-rate player can coast along in his pro career forever as long as he's a local boy — best environment ever.
Even a third-rate player can coast along in his pro career forever as long as he's a local boy — best environment ever.
These days, a lot of players with MLB ambitions probably want to avoid the Giants and SoftBank, since they don't approve postings.
Re: #79
You don't know about Okamoto?
You don't know about Okamoto?
Re: #79
The Giants have approved postings plenty of times.
The Giants have approved postings plenty of times.
Background and Key Points of This Debate
Japan’s draft system, introduced in 1965, has generally resolved cases where multiple teams compete for the same player by lottery. From 1993 to 2007, a “self-nomination/free-acquisition slot” system applied to university and corporate-league players, but fierce bidding for star prospects turned it into a hotbed for slush money, and after incidents such as the 2006 Ichiba bribery scandal, the system was scrapped in favor of the current full waiver/lottery format. The “self-nomination era” referenced in the thread refers to this period. MLB’s draft is structurally different — it selects far more players than Japan’s does, and teams are allowed to trade draft picks — so using the same words “draft” or “lottery” doesn’t make the two systems directly comparable. It’s also worth noting that most cases where a player publicly named his preferred team and ended up joining it happened because that team chose to welcome him, not because the system guaranteed his wish would be honored — a distinction that’s easy to miss.
※This article is excerpted and summarized from the 5channel (“Live Breaking News G”) thread “[Sad News] High Schooler Says “I Want to Join the Giants,” NPB Says “No, We’ll Decide by Lottery”.”
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